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Talk:Development/@comment-26393217-20160511153848
About Knights Here some ramble, or ideas about how to have a better Knights faction, that is, as far as I'm concerned, and without much balance consideration (I let this to the real play tester). As you'll see, that's about small details that enhance a certain idea of game immersion, and thus, that should help having a game more replayable. I understand that more dedicated TBS players don't care so much about them, provided the game is balanced and fun to play. 1) Dancing swords shooting arrows from inside towers are no fun. Knights have got swordsmen for that purpose. I don't know how to prevent such units to enter towers, or to upgrade towers. Perhaps, hardcoding that a monster/summoned flagged unit can't enter a tower (the same as illusionnary infantry can't enter a tower). Also, Dancing Swords shouldn't regenerate. Do they reforge themselves? 2) Basic and advanced cavalry units (knights) are quite redundant. As for me, when not hard pressed by the AI, I never produce basic knights, indeed. Granted, they are a little faster, and a few of them could be sent to destroy far mines, early. Even the Imperial pikeman differentiate from the more advanced and potent halberdier by his damage type. It was discuted here, and on the Enlight Forum that those knights could be lancers and deal pearcing damage. Another way to differentiate all the knights could be to make them efficient against different units, without to ressort to the old (good?) rock-scissor-paper system, the Warlords serie's managed to avoid so far. I mean, basic knights useful against cavalry, champion knights useful against medium (human-size infantry), knight lords useful against large or only huge creatures (e.g.), either through doubled damage, or through stats balancing. - Then, as an anti-cavalry unit, the basic knight should win against any basic cavalry. Is its resistance to physical damage enough? - I see the Champion as a heavy melee tank, perhaps even slower than currently, well armoured against other cavalry units, and deadly against human-size infantry. Indeed, a line of Champions charging a swordsmen line should nearly destroy them outright. Should they charge a line of Pikemen instead, it would be a stalemate (i.e. a bloody affair for both sides) or a slight advantage to the Pikemen. To help in balancing the pike vs. horse duel, we could consider some disasters suffered by the irl French Cavalry in recorded history: Bourgundian late medieval heavy cavalry against Swiss pikemen at Morat (1476), French Renaissance heavy cavalry against Swiss halberdiers (Renaissance pikemen) at Marignano (1515). To reflect the power of their mount, I'd even add a low Trample ability (less than the Elephant's), but only if the Dwarves don't become ridiculous against them (to be tested). - Knight Lord would become quasi-heroes, slayers of mythical creatures, and a pale copy of the dragons slayer Dragon Knights. I'm not sure about whether adding a bonus or doubled damage against huge units, and/or adding a limited Reave skill. Suggestion: - Knight: change damage type to piercing (if possible change the sprite and animation that would fit a lancer), double damage against cavalry to emulate a cavalry charge, balance (adjust) damage accordingly (or trade the doubled damage with a bonus damage?); I see them like Macedonian hetarois, and they would translate real life most common mounted knights. Even in the end game, they could form the first line of any cavalry attack, as a lighter anti-cavalry unit. Perhaps, they wouldn't then benefit from Paladin research anymore? - Champion: investigate the possibility to deal double damage versus medium units (if not too overpowered). I see like a squadron of champion knights would walk (not charge) through any non pike infantry square like if butter. Otherwise, the Champion is fine as he is, a melee physical tanker. - Lord: although they are already formidable as they are, perhaps a better efficiency against huge units or against any monsters would help seeing them as proto-heroes (Knights of the Round Table). 3) Specialize the Knight faction into various orders of chivalry. Although the lore of Etheria tell about the 5 Agarian orders of chivalry: Bartonians, Elenians, Theirians, Sirians, Gildans, there's no sign of them during the Battle. Hence the suggestion to allow for a one-time choice to specialize the Knights faction, at keep level 3 or 4. The choice popup window allows for 4 possibilities (see Summon Weather and Raise Champion spells, and the knightly quest at the Shrine of the Sword). Then, let's say that the Bartonians, the most numerous knights, are the default (current) faction, and that the 4 other orders are the specialized factions. Hence we'd have: Elenian: master at bow, up to the point to deny the Selentide Empire the path to Agaria. Theirian: master at the battle axe, sturdy people hunting the troll for leisure. We could even make them like dismounted knights. Perhaps also, sturdier buildings due to the dwarven proximity. Sirian: master knights, spiritual and proficient people (most Agarian heroes are Sirian, as lore says). Gildan: not the best fighters, but very wealthy and cunning (or worse). Perhaps, a barbarian mercenary at the Market? Intended result: - Elenian knights would relie more on squires (only subpar to the Elves) when they walk on the field; of course, their most powerful asset would still be the cavalry, but face to other knights (e.g.) they would try and use archers one way or another (like the English Longbowmen, irl). Think about Robin Wood and the Ithilian Rangers. - Theirian knights would relie more on infantry, swordsmen along with some archers, and cavalry to protect them, to add brute force, and to pursue the routed. The slashing damage would become that of an axe. They could build sturdier buildings, too. - Sirians would have the best cavalry, and the best inquisitors and dancing swords. - Gildans would have the best economy, but their basic units would be penalized. How to proceed? Through new added upgrades, free existing upgrades (as if granted through quests), modified stats, modified hero skills. I propose three ways to specialize the faction, which could be mixed altogether: 3.1 Upon choosing an order of chivalry (not choosing means staying with the Bartonians), the units and the Hero gain the following skills/powers: - (default) Bartonians: (+10 XP to new mounted knights) (Cbt bonus for mounted knights) (best enemy XP bonus for mounted knights) - Elenians: + 10 XP to new squires, either no XP bonus for mounted knights >OR< Knight Protector -2, Merchant -5, Damage and Combat bonus to squires. - Theirians: + 10 XP to new swordsmen, either no XP bonus for mounted knights >OR< Knight Protector -2, Knight Lord +4, Merchant - 5, Damage, Combat and Armor bonus to swordsmen. - Sirians: as default + Knight Lord +2, Knight Protector +2 (for a minimum +20 XP bonus), additional Cbt bonus (+3?) for mounted knights, free Trade research, Merchant - 5 (costliest units). - Gildans: no XP bonus for mounted knights >OR< Knight Protector -2, Knight Lord -4, Merchant +5, Wealth +2 (or +4?) Then we should have the following comparison: Morale: Gildans < Elenians = Bartonians < Sirians < Theirians Economy: Elenians = Theirians < Bartonians < Sirians << Gildans Cavalry XP & stats: Gildans = Elenians = Theirians < Bartonians < Sirians Archer XP & stats: Gildans = Bartonians = Theirians = Sirians << Elenians Infantry XP & stats: Gildans = Bartonians = Elenians = Sirians << Theirians The Merchant penalty (making most heroes at 40% trading efficiency) is because Elenians and Theirians are quite isolated, and Sirians have so high moral standards that they are less pragmatic, though this is partly alleviated with a free Trade research, thanks to the Dwarves proximity and friendship. Bartonians are the default knight merchants, and the cost of the Trade research should be (is) quite high as compared to the Empire research. Sadly, I figure that the Knight Lord penalty/bonus won't be used if the Hero as a high enough Leadership skill. Perhaps, the Elenians could have a +5 Armor bonus to any infantry ranged unit, Therians have a +5 Armor to any infantry melee unit, and Sirians have a +5 Armor to any cavalry unit. 3.2 Another way to differentiate between the orders could be to elect a "chosen" unit, either the squire, the swordsman or the mounted knights, that would be a better Crusader (the non-chosen units would be less efficient Crusaders). This added benefit or malus would be balanced by some items picked from the above suggestions. Bartonians: default Crusade effects (+1 XP/research) (perhaps research would cost more or take a longer time to research) Elenians: only the squires are crusaders, but with better effects (+2 XP/research?). Alternatively, other units gain a +1 XP each other research. (+1/+1/+2/+2/+3) Theirians: same as Elenians but for the swordsmen. Sirians: same as Elenians but for the mounted knights. Gildans: same as Bartonians, or even the reduced effect as proposed for the non chosen units. 3.3 Another way to differentiate between the orders could be the possibility to hire a dedicated advanced mercenary unit at the market (after a research at the market). Bartonians: no mercenaries (all their neighbours are knights). Elenians: Elven from Sylvermyr (woodriders, hunters or treants?) or Imperials from Selentis (halberdiers?) or unicorns (from Sylvermyr) (cf the Tribe of the Unicorn). Theirians: Dwarven! (berserkers to help against other cavalry) Sirians: White mages (yes, a general) Gildans: Dark Elves Assassins? 4) Inquisitors animate swords instead of summoning them. Currently (v1.03.25), inquisitors summon 3 lvl 1 dancing swords (+1/level of mastery) which are permanent. As with other summoners, they can only cast their spell if there's at least 1 pop left. Shrines of the Sword can produce swords and can summon them too, though the last process needs corpses nearby to turn them into swords. It's called "reanimating the swords of the fallen". As far as realism concerns me in this fantasy game, I'd like better if inquisitors would enchant the "swords of the fallen nearby", instead of making them appear from nowhere, as a grant from Sirian, maybe. Secondly, being a kind of animation spell or prayer, I'd like better if these animation would last only for a few minutes. Let's the Shrine of the Sword cast a powerful spell that animate permanent swords (or temporary too?), but let's have the inquisitors cast "mansize", timed spells. The duration of the summon would be long enough to let the swords die at fighting.